Be the best at your Marketing Management with Jess Mahon

Pete interviews Jess Mahon, marketing director at Countryside Rentals (doing business as Rent to Own) in Ohio — a company with 40-plus stores under Mike Tissett's leadership. Jess came up through the store side, starting as an account manager in 2013 where she recognized half her route from her prior job at a local bank. She became a store manager five months in, built a Facebook presence for a small store that gained more friends than the store had active customers, and transitioned into marketing in 2016 without a formal marketing background — a degree in business and psychology, but no advertising training.

The conversation covers what it actually looks like to run marketing for a mid-sized RTO company. Jess and her creative director Kate are a two-person team. Their website is r2o.com, and they've staffed a rotating group of five or six people who handle live chat in shifts — not AI, actual employees working from home who field customer questions, help with account lookups, and capture leads directly into their CRM. About 87% of their web traffic is mobile, which drove their recent shift to clean, even-dollar pricing — easier to read, easier to say, and more honest since everyone rounds up anyway.

On SEO, Jess breaks it into four areas: blast your URL everywhere, focus on keywords that describe what you do rather than what you sell (compete on "rent" and "lease," not "furniture" or "electronics"), make sure your site has fresh mobile-friendly content, and partner with someone who actually understands how RTO differs from retail. Their partner is Wow Brands, who helped build the R2O digital platform and CRM specifically for the industry.

The biggest learning moment she shares is a product called "R2O to You" — a fully automated direct-ship model launched before the pandemic where customers could select, apply, sign, and schedule delivery entirely online without visiting a store. It flopped not because the technology didn't work, but because customers still wanted to come in and talk to Amy or Richie. The experience gave Jess an "aha moment" about the customer journey: they don't view it transactionally the way operators do. For customers, the relationship with the store is part of the value.

On social media, Facebook still drives their primary customer base, with Instagram growing slowly and Instagram Live just getting started. TikTok is on the horizon but with a concern: the best influencers for rent-to-own are the people inside the stores, not outside influencers who don't understand the industry. Real CSRs and managers doing live content outperform paid talent because customers already know and trust them.

Her advice to her younger self: just be yourself. She spent years trying to prove she belonged in a marketing role she didn't feel qualified for. Once she stopped performing confidence and started actually being herself on Facebook Live, customers responded and engagement went up.

Transcript

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Pete Shau 1:39

Find out what people can use for you today by checking out their website at rtoh.org. That's rtoh.org. Onto the show. Hello and welcome to the RTO show. I'm your host, Pete Cow, and today I'm talking to Jess Mahan in Ohio from Rent2Own, the marketing director who's going to give us some insight on the art of marketing management. How are you doing today, Jess?

Jess Mahon 2:10

I'm good. Thanks for having me, Pete.

Pete Shau 2:12

So one of the things I wanted to talk to you about is how you make all this magical madness happen. Like we were just talking about. So you actually'm on the website, and we actually have people from Rent2Own who are doing the chat. Now, you know, before I get into everything else, that was pretty cool. I thought it was an AI. And you said there's rotating people on your chat that do this all the time.

Jess Mahon 2:32

Yeah, so there's a group of uh five or six people that answer questions, they help with a customer needs if they need their customer number or their agreement number to make a payment online. They work in four-hour shifts, I believe, every day, and they have normal days off, just like you know, as if they were in a store. Um, but yeah, they sit, they work from home, they sit at the computer and get leads for us from our website.

Pete Shau 2:57

That's that's awesome. We're gonna talk about that in a little bit. But for anybody who doesn't know Jess, why don't you give us a little bit of background on your rent to own history and what you have going on there in Rent to Own?

Jess Mahon 3:08

Um, okay, well, I have been, it's almost been 10 years for me already in the industry, um, which is crazy to think about because time just goes by so fast. Um, but I actually started at Rent to Own in December of 2013. So it was right at Christmas time in the town that I live in, I started as an account manager. Um, and one of the things that I remember on my first day was opening up VersaRint and opening up, you know, the collections call list. And I recognized a lot of the names of the people that were on my route. Um, because before Rent to Own, I had been an assistant manager at a bank here in town. It was sort of the same customer base. So it made it feel like even though I had left one job and started another, I felt like I was still at home, if that makes sense, because I was used to still seeing the same sort of customers. Um, and it made me a really good account manager, I think, because they were already used to seeing me. So then coming and making their payments to me, we had already established a relationship. I think that's the biggest thing that makes, you know, a good collector is you know the relationship they have with their customers. Um, but so I did really well, and then I was only with the company maybe five months, I think. And there was an opportunity store manager had set down at a store that was relatively close to me, which was great. I was up for the challenge, was in that store, and that store I think had only been opened for I want to say a little over a year before I I had got there. Um, so it was tough. I went from this already established store to a small new store that, you know, didn't have the customer base and traffic. So we spent a lot of time door hanging and making calls and community involvement, and really we did um Facebook. Facebook back then was not as big as it is today in our industry. So the, I mean, this really for us the structure wasn't even the same. Um, if like a store had a Facebook page, it wasn't because the company had made it one, it was because the folks in that store created it on their own, kind of thing, which is what we did. And back then it wasn't, you know, business Facebook wasn't even a thing yet. So you just had a bunch of friends. So we just started inviting all of our customers to be friends and then maxed out the friend request uh every week on Facebook. And I think we we gained like 2,000 friends, um, and it only had like 200 customers. It was crazy. So we actually had more friends on Facebook than we did on our active customer list.

Pete Shau 5:42

That's amazing.

Jess Mahon 5:43

Yeah, it was it was unique. We used it for you know sales and specials and things like that. It was cool. Um, then we were able we were actually the the best part about that is we were then able to convert that page into the current business page, so they just kept rolling with that momentum, and I think that store is up to like 5,000 likes or something crazy. So it was pretty cool, but yeah, that and then I went to another store and got a chance to work in another store as a store manager, and then in the spring of 2016, my predecessor had stepped down and um just Mike called me up and presented me an opportunity in marketing, which I was hesitant to take at first because I don't come from a marketing background. Um, I have a degree in business and a degree in psychology, but he kind of assured me, like, you know, you you can't mess up. You know, if something's not working, we'll change it. We'll be here to help you. You have a great, you know, support staff and home office and people along the way. And so I took it and I tried really hard to learn as much as I can as quickly as possible. I was reading a lot and you know, just talking to some people, and and then that fall, like four months of being in marketing, I think is when I was on my first panel talking about digital marketing and um SEO and things like that. So that's kind of how I got to where I am now. I did start in a store. I I have that connection um with what I do. I can I can visualize myself being in that store because that's where I was.

Pete Shau 7:10

Well, if anybody wants to know what Jess looks like, if you haven't seen her talking at any of the shows, which you probably have, or if you haven't seen a one around with Mike, go to the RTO or the Rnumber20.com website, go all the way to the bottom, and there she is on the right side, throwing up the peace signs. Who's that with you?

Jess Mahon 7:27

That is uh Kate Addy. She is my partner in crime in the marketing department. She's the creative director. So all of the you know, assets that you see on any of our mailers or designs come from her, really, her talent. She she's really good at what she does.

Pete Shau 7:43

So you have a counterpart, you do the marketing, she does the creative thinking. How does that set the RTO culture aside from the other RTO companies? How does that make you guys unique in your mindset?

Jess Mahon 7:55

Well, you know, for us, you know, with marketing, I think it's a love-hate relationship with the fact that there's only two of us. Some days we're like, man, we need some more people in here. Um, but then other days it makes it a little bit easier for us to bounce ideas off of each other. Or um, you know, because I am in the marketing side of it, I'm in stores a little bit more than she is. So she'll ask, you know, how did this work? What does this look like? And that kind of thing. So, and it goes further than just our department to the core of what the rent-to-own family really means. And I know that's going to sound a little cliche, but it's on our logo, it's in our culture. It we really do take it seriously. We all just love what we do. Um, we understand that it's a tricky business and know that there's ups and downs, you know, seeing some stores struggling while others are being successful. Um, it it sometimes is just hard, but we all know that we're there for each other, we can count on each other, we can, you know, reach out to somebody else. Um, we're all in, which is our 2023 mantra. We come up with one every year at our annual meeting. Um, and I think the second part of that really is just the leadership team that we have, um, which really has nothing to do with me, but the home office and support staff, um, we have two district managers who each have four regionals under them. So eight regionals total. And I think like between the 10 of those folks, just the district, two district managers and the eight regional managers, there's got to be probably 150 years combined of total R2O knowledge in that group of people alone. So they have a solid understanding of the foundation of what rent-to-own is and how to grow people when they they aren't um afraid to take the time and answer your questions and help you be what you need to be in this industry, which I think is really what it boils down to. If we had, you know, managers who were micromanagers and you know, bossy, I don't think it would be as good or as fun of a place to to work. But don't get me wrong, I mean, we're we're very serious about what we do, but it all starts with that family. Like it's there's a lot of love in our in our company, I think.

Pete Shau 10:08

Well, I think if you're in the rent-to-owned business, there's always a strong passion. You're either passionate about getting it done or you're passionate about the frustrations that prevent you from getting it done. But either way, you put a lot of heart and soul to it. So when you said that is your your go-to this year, the 2023, the all-in mantra?

Jess Mahon 10:25

Yep.

Pete Shau 10:26

Okay, all right. So this year it's all in. So then what was it last year?

Jess Mahon 10:29

It changes every year, and honestly, it's just like you get so instilled with what you what you're doing this year. Um, we've had like we're we're different. I think that's what it what it was last year is like diff, and then rent is in the middle. Like, we're different. So it's like we have to be different than the other rent-to-owned companies out there. Like, how are we different? We we're teachable, we you know, we care, we honor what we say, things like that. Um, like I said, this year it's all in. It's just like, you know, don't be afraid to try, don't be afraid, don't get, don't stay at the bottom. Like it's okay to be frustrated, it's okay to know that, you know, this industry is hard, your business is hard, but you have to get up, do the work, do what you know needs done, and and get back, you know, going. So, and then everyone's on the same page, so reach out if you need help. That's kind of what the all-in message is.

Pete Shau 11:25

So I got a question because I was very unsure about this, and I meant to ask Mike about this when he was on the show, and I did not, but you've got the rent-to-own moniker, right? And and it's it it kind of incorporates a lot. But then you got the countryside rentals. So is it countryside rentals doing business as rent-to-own, or is rent to own a can you help me out with that? How does that work?

Jess Mahon 11:45

Yeah, that's a good question. We honestly get asked that a lot, I think, or I feel like when I'm at the shows and things, they're like countryside rentals, and it's it's weird for us to hear because we go by rent to own. So it is countryside rentals doing business as rent to own.

Pete Shau 11:59

Okay. So you've got this 2023, this 2023 idea that you're all in. Is that culture really bringing you guys to stand out?

Jess Mahon 12:08

Yeah, I think so, because I mean the the message or the the tag, I I tagline for the year really kind of stems from I'm just gonna say, like the business message that Mike presents. So we have an annual meeting every year that usually takes place in February. And at that annual meeting, you know, there's awards presented and we talk about the business a little bit and we go over, you know, we play games with each other, we have a nice launch, and there's a car giveaway. So it's it's we spend an entire day on a Wednesday, even so, all of our stores close for that day where we just are celebrating rent to own, and we acknowledge some really good folks in the company that have done really well throughout the year. And in that, Mike talks about you know the business, like the um ups and downs of the year that we've had, some you know uh things that are happening like throughout the industry as far as trends and um you know products. For example, the PS5 was really hot, now it's not. So it's like everyone has to be all in on making up that revenue that the PS5 generated because it's not gonna be that this year. So he kind of ties whatever um his business message is into the mantra. So it is effective, I think, for us to change it every year because the message does change every year, but it's not meant to be like, you know, we did bad last year, so let's be better this year. It's more of like, let's just be all in. It's a new year, it's a fresh start, so we make something new, so we're not carrying that old uh feeling from from the last year if it was a bad year kind of thing.

Pete Shau 13:47

It helps you blend with what's going on currently.

Jess Mahon 13:49

Yeah.

Pete Shau 13:50

So you know, again, earlier we were talking about having somebody who literally pops up on the screen and they talking to you and give you some information if you need it or some direction if you need it. Uh how does is your CRM different compared to the CRMs that are being used in Rent2Own? Or have you noticed that it, you know, is it a blanket CRM that you guys use and you kind of just make it fit for what you guys are doing? Because my one of my biggest one of my biggest complaints is I hear that the CRMs that are available out there are not, you know, they don't pertain necessarily to rent-to-own. And a lot of rent-to-owns have to take it and tailor it. And I see that when she popped up and it's an actual person, are you taking something out there that's already built for retail and kind of just making it work for rent-to-wn? Or do you guys have one that's really set up that is rent-owned friendly?

Jess Mahon 14:34

Um, so our CRM that we use currently is actually has nothing to do with our chat platform that we use. So we use a program called Zendesk for our chat chatters to use. And that is a retail site that's, you know, you can do chat on any site that you want. So it it makes it a little bit easier because the chat side of it doesn't have to be tailored to rent-to-own because it's just conversational based. Whereas the CRM, however, I agree with you. I think that for a long time, CRMs have just been designed for retail and molded into the rent-to-owned world as best as it could be, and then that left companies filling in the void for things that they needed to do and get accomplished. For us, we use the R20 digital platform with WoW brands. So I was actually fortunate to sort of be involved in that process from the beginning of it coming to life. Uh, we've used WoW brands for several years for our website. So we've already had that relationship there. So when they brought the idea of creating a CRM for the industry, I was like, okay, well, here's a list of things that we would like. And I just kind of like spoke from my experience at Rent to Own and said, you know, here's what the industry needs as like checklist. And I think that what they have built so far is pretty, pretty good. And they've done a great job of putting something together together specifically for rent to own. But I know that like First Rent now or Ideal has a CRM that's designed to make the lead to sale process a lot easier. I think having everything in one place is fantastic. I don't think that we're quite there yet with anything that I've seen, but we can for what we do on our 20th digital platform, we can take our chatters and have them fill out a lead form and it does go into our CRM. We can all of our online leads filter into the CRM. We have what we call community leads, which are would be just like walk-ins or leads you would get from a customer in store. We can put those in the CRM. So we're getting a lot closer of having everything in the same place.

Pete Shau 16:44

So basically, we're using the online chat to funnel them into the CRM, which for everybody out there is a customer relations management software. So if we're talking about CRM, that's what we're talking about, what they use on websites and to tailor the customers to get them into being an actual customer. So we're using the online chat to funnel them into the CRM, which then creates a leaderboard or at least a board where people are going to be contacted or messaged depending on what it is they want, and then we're going to try to open them up an agreement, correct?

Jess Mahon 17:14

Yes.

Pete Shau 17:16

So getting people to your site. So then you you've got this new CRM that you guys are working on that's a lot more tailored to rent to own than it had been. You've got somebody sitting on the chat. What are some of the most effective search engine optimization practices that you use that would separate rent-to-own from the retail, right? Because sometimes you put in sofas or bedroom furniture and you're going to get a plethora of things. And we'll just we'll just throw them in there because they're great to our industry. But let's say Ashley, and why would why would they go to Ashley versus coming to our site? What do you use to kind of differentiate the wording so that they'll come to a rent-to-own store's website?

Jess Mahon 17:51

So SEO search engine optimization uh is really just a clunky way of saying to Google and other search engines, but mostly Google, who you are, what you do, and why they should rank you above everyone else who is searching for the same thing. I would break it down really into four parts, is for me, we're lucky because our website is literally just r2o.com. But I think the first thing is you have to blast your website everywhere. I mean, it I know this is gonna be redundant, but even on your website, you have to have your website. That that's an important thing. Get letting people know where to find you is like the biggest thing. It really isn't searching for you, but they're going to search for you if you show them where to search. Um, also, like you had said, focusing on keywords that aren't industry specific. And what I mean by that is you have to use keywords that tell what you do, not what you sell. And that sounds crazy, but things like rent and lease and even branded keywords that have things to do with your company is going to be more impactful than using the words like you had said, furniture or even electronics, or using the brands or specific products that traditional retail would do. Because if you do that, I feel like you're just wasting your money because you're not going to compete with, you know, Ashley Home Store or the bigger chains of retail. But number two is you have to make sure your website is full of good content. Um, I think that I've seen a lot of websites update and refresh. And I think that it a lot of the sites that I've seen in the industry are a lot better from say when I looked 10 years ago kind of thing, even ours. Um, but making sure that you're putting out good content and updating your website regularly and just focusing on who you are, like I said, um, and making sure this is important too, is that your website is mobile friendly. That I mean, I I would probably move that to the top of the list because as I'm sure you know, Pete, like almost 90% of your customers probably shop from their cell phone, or it's it's crazy high. So um customers are on their phone and they don't want to wait long periods of time for your page to load. And lastly, this is really important, is just finding a partner in a company that understands SEO and how what we do in our industry is very different than traditional retail. So understanding rent to own is a must. We we use um Wow brands, we have a great partner with partnership with them, with Ryan Crass and his team. Um, because I I'm not even going to sit here and pretend that I could give you a presentation on Google Analytics. There's just so much information that's put in front of you with graphs and charts and numbers and things like that. Um, but we're very lucky to work with them and they understand it and they explain it to us. And I ask a lot of questions. Um, and let's be clear too, uh, Google is very much a pay-to-play environment. So you cannot be afraid to spend money on Google and see the results, but also understand that those results take time.

Pete Shau 21:53

So there's two things I wanted to ask you. The first one is you said like up to 90% of your internet traffic is mobile, is that right?

Jess Mahon 21:59

Yes, yeah. It's it's like 87% of our users on our website are using coming to us from their mobile device.

Pete Shau 22:08

Well, everybody, if you're just just to kind of let you know, if you're not dialed into the mobile network, and I've noticed that as well on my site, as far as the podcasts go, is that I'm about 85% as far as mobile, and then I have a 10% that are from desks, and then I have a 5% that's another so so 85% of my traffic is exactly the same. But then so I'm on the website and I noticed, unlike everybody else, that I normally see, normally I see a $33.99, I see a $29.99, I see a $22.99. I'm actually seeing even numbers. Is that something that to make you stand out, or is that just the way you guys price things?

Jess Mahon 22:43

You know, that's just a a recent change. I would say in the last year or so, we just went to even numbers and it just it just is cleaner. It just looks more sharp. It's like a round number instead of saying like, oh, this is $44.99, or just like it's $45. Like, what's the extra penny really gonna matter, right?

Pete Shau 23:02

Well, I know, I know back in the days it would say it's a mental thing. You know, it's just it's we can actually say that it's less than $50 or $49.99. It's like, no, it's it's fifty dollars.

Jess Mahon 23:11

I mean, it it really kind of came from us just like talking, right? Like if you're talking to somebody else that you work with and you're like, you know, the laptop that's $44.99 and you you're just constantly saying that, no, you're saying $45. So if we're saying $45, because we're rounding up, your customers are too. So we just made the change.

Pete Shau 23:29

So now you have 90% web traffic. Now, when you're talking about the completion of sales, actually people getting onto an agreement that weren't on agreement before they started their trip to the store or trip to the online, how much would you say your your walk in traffic has declined that you're actually closing? Is it the same as you have we gone down to 10% physically, or is it still somewhat there? Maybe we're just not closing all of them, just like we're not closing all the online leads. Like, is it really down to ten percent, or are you guys seeing a little bit more walk in traffic than ten percent?

Jess Mahon 24:00

No, I think that It's it's about the same, but I think that we've really dialed into the uh in-store traffic a lot better than we used to do. And what I mean by that is is like traffic has declined in-store, you know, um, especially since COVID happened where everybody just got used to shopping online. So now it's kind of like, well, we don't know if we'll ever get that foot traffic back. So we, you know, last spent the last couple of years kind of like we're still here. So we treat the customers who come in store like you know, gold, like literal gold. Like, do you want coffee? Do you want, you know, can I fluff your pill out? Like, not to that extreme, but we really, we really make uh it an effort to close the folks that come in or at least get a lead. Like, what are you interested in? They're looking at a refrigerator. Okay, I'm gonna take this note, I'm gonna put it in my system to follow up in a couple of days. We really work the in-store traffic a lot better, more thoroughly than I think we used to. Um, as far as the online traffic, this is just, you know, my opinion, but it it's facts that are out there. You know, 80% of shoppers will check you out on Google or your website before they commit to the sale. Um, and Google says even 87%, so it's it's relatively close. Um, and also like you have Facebook saying that 65% of shoppers will look you up on social media before they come in. So those are really high numbers. Now, if I had 65 or 80% of my customers coming in the store, like that would be like crazy. I would love those numbers. But I would say if you have a really good online presence and they don't commit to you online, they're probably going to come to you in store if they're looking at you know what we offer rent to own. But you can easily get 30 to 40 percent of your business from your online traffic. That's where we typically stay. We typically stay between 30 and 35 percent. But I will caution you and say that getting those leads is the easy part. You know, I like I said, our website is really short and we blast it every everywhere. And, you know, we we do Google ads and things like that. So getting our name out there and getting the the leads from the online traffic is easy. Now, closing them, that is where, you know, I think we all can uh improve and we all look for ways to make that better. But getting that customer in an agreement fast is where you know we all tend to struggle. You know, if you don't answer that customer fast enough, you you risk losing them to competition, right? Um, Mike always says, you know, I hate the thought of a lead coming in at Saturday at 5 p.m. because we close at four on Saturdays, and then having that customer sit in the queue until we open Monday morning. Um, and that's something that we're working as a company to get better at. And I think that finding the right CRM to manage those leads is why that's important.

Pete Shau 26:49

I can't agree more. I totally understand. You know, we're always trying to look for new things to make it better. I that's one thing I love about rent to own Jess is that when we're doing things and we find out it's not working, we as a company, we as an industry, we as a people look for better ways to make it better. And then, you know, as you as you move on, you'll see two to three years from now we're not what we were two to three years ago. And two to three years uh ahead of that, we'll be different than we were, you know, in the future. So it's like every every two to three years you see those notches where we used to do this, but now we do this. And we run our website this way and we say certain things on the website to contract these customers, and we move it from here to there. And it's really nice to see, especially since I've been able to talk to a lot of people in the RTO space about the different things that we do and how we do them and the education that comes with it every year and how we change it up from what we learn and what we know. It's just an ever-growing system. So with all these additions, with all these great things that you've done, you've leveled out the pricing, you have an RTO.com name that you can blast everywhere, you're trying to put live people on the chat, and you're taking people and fulling them into your CRM. Those are great things. What about those things that don't go so well? What would you say, Jess, has been a tremendous, like, oh my goodness, I can't even believe we did that. One of those uh crazy things that you learn from and said, we probably shouldn't do that again.

Jess Mahon 28:05

Well, maybe let me think. There was one thing uh that it just makes me laugh because we we tried, we really did. We wanted it, we wanted it to work so bad. It's something that we called R2O to you, which was a process that we tried to set up where the customer selects the product online, they complete the rental agreement online, they get approved online, and then all the customer has to do then is just set up a delivery day. We will ship that product to them at their house for free. So the customer doesn't even have to come in, they don't have to call us or anything, it's all automated and done online. Um, and of course, you know, we would limit we limited the products to like a I think there was a bed in the box, some TVs, game systems, and a few other smaller things. But you would think that as I'm telling you the story, that we had this idea and started this after COVID, but no. Uh, we had this idea and started mocking things up. I want to say an entire year before COVID. So this spring of 2019, and we wanted it to get ready to launch for fourth quarter, and we were so excited. We were like, this is gonna work, this is what our customers want. They're online, they're online shoppers now. We were we were really excited. I mean, we marketed it everywhere. We had it on every mail or email campaign, social media. It was a giant feature in our wish book that year, and it just flopped. It did not take off. Our customers were just like, Yeah, that's cool. But like, can I go in and see Amy in Circleville? Or, you know, can I go, can I go to Zane's hill and see Richie? Like, even though we provided this opportunity for the customers to get everything that they would need online and not need to come in, um, we had a few people do it, but they would still call their local store. They still wanted that interaction um with their local store. They wanted that connection. And I think honestly, that was the first time that I had this aha moment where I realized just how special it is what we do. You know, not only do we help customers own incredible things and provide them opportunities, but it's the journey that they enjoy also. And I think that sometimes we get lost in what the customer journey is. We tend to look at it from a very transactional point of view, as far as, okay, the customer submitted a lead, and now we have to get them in a rental agreement, and now we have to get them to pay on time. Okay, they're about to pay out. What can we get them in now? And we look at that journey very transactionally, where the customer looks at it like I get a nice couch or I get a nice refrigerator, and I get to go in and talk to Amy, and she's asking me about my day, and she knows about you know my surgery I had last week, and I get to show her my kids, and she communicates, you know, with my dog, and you know, things like that. I think the customer journey from the customer standpoint is very different from the way we tend to look at it. And I think watching this flop because customers wanted that connection to their local store, I was like, oh, I really get it now. But then also it made it a little more challenging when three months after that in 2020, you know, everyone's locked in their houses and we're all masked up and can't go anywhere. So it's like, well, we know this doesn't work, so what now?

Pete Shau 31:28

It was it was challenging. I can only imagine. I wouldn't say it's a flop. Would would you say that it was at the wrong time frame and maybe that's something coming down the pipe, or do you think that's probably something you're gonna stay away from?

Jess Mahon 31:39

Um, yeah, when I say flop, I I say it was just the wrong time. I think there's always an opportunity to take that idea and make it better. Especially, I think that there will be a time when customers, like the next generation of customers, you know, people in their 20s and things like that, probably are gonna want a want less interaction with stores. Um, so that yeah, you're you're right about that. I think that when I I say flop, I just mean like it, we needed to wait a couple years for that idea to come to fruition, I think.

Pete Shau 32:10

Or maybe just three more months.

Jess Mahon 32:13

Yeah.

Pete Shau 32:14

Just a little bit longer.

Jess Mahon 32:16

Even then it was crazy. Um, I mean, I I would say we didn't go back to the direct ship idea because we just came off of it, you know, not working. But customers, I don't know if you experienced this, but they still wanted to come to the store. I mean, we had no problems with we actually had to tell customers like you can't come in unless you're wearing a mask, or you know, if you're sick, stay away. I remember, you know, putting those signs on the doors and stuff. And so what what we did for the COVID thing was uh curbside pickup, and that that was a huge success.

Pete Shau 32:49

I do remember those days, unfortunately. I wish I could say I don't remember any of them. You know, it's it's been crazy. Almost the entirety of this podcast since it's been open. We always refer to those days again, like, oh, you remember the COVID this and you remember the COVID that and how it affected this and how it affected the business and our customers and our transactions, uh, you know, the cash flow and how we had to figure out if we were essential or not, and what there's so many things that went with that. It literally up-ended the whole entirety of rent own, kind of set it sideways and said, Okay, you can do it, but you've got to do it within these parameters. Now, what are you gonna do? And it just made so many of us think outside the box. And uh, you know, when you're talking about establishing new ways to do things and getting things done, it's always good to look to the future and it's always good to be forward-thinking. But did you have any help? I mean, is there influential people in your life that kind of helped you think forward-thinking and that kind of helped you settle into RTO and made it better? I mean, do you have a few people that maybe mentored you or kind of just gave you that words of wisdom that kind of put you on the course you're on now? And now a word from our sponsor. Box really is the best graphics production agency in Red2Own offering current key service for design production. They offer printing and production, catalogs, any kind of creative services, interesting heads, have the knowledge and experience of working with Red2On for years, and they make it easy to get your brand recognized and utilized. You can contact them at 770-476-5112, or visit them online at vox-bop-ulli.com. And now, back to the show.

Jess Mahon 34:31

Absolutely. I mean, they're not in the rent-to-owned industry, but um I cannot go without saying um my family for sure. I mean, I'm I'm super close with my family, my parents, my siblings, uh, my grandma is literally my best friend. And also my fiance, he works in the industry, so that's very nice that I can come home and if I'm frustrated, he gets it. If I had a great day, he gets it. But without their support of you know, changing careers from the banking world into rent to own, and then should transitioning from um what I was doing in store to marketing when I didn't feel confident, I would say like I I couldn't have done it without their support at all. And then inside the industry, I think that the vendors are amazing. Like we have some really great vendors um inside the industry, and uh it I think that they were a crucial part for me to be successful, and uh I wouldn't be where I am today, I don't think without a few of them. I'm lucky to have formed some friendships over the years, and like for example, Kevin Silvers, everyone knows Kevin, but man, in the beginning, and everybody knows Kevin, everybody knows Kevin, he's great, you know, he's he's good, he's good people, but he in the beginning and still does today connect me to different people throughout the industry, and he shares ideas, you know, with me. If he has an idea, he'll call and be like, hey, oh, you know, I saw this sweatshirt idea, and what do you think about doing it for you guys? Or you know, one of our district managers then was on vacation and he just calls Kevin up and like, hey, I saw this tire, koozie. We sell tires, what do you think? And it's just a great thing to have a relationship with someone like Kevin. Um, and he also like encourages me, like just when I need it. Like, I don't know if you remember when the um ELC group, the emerging leaders group was kind of like formed. I think we only went through like one round of it because then COVID, like boom, happened right when it got launched. But he called me up and he's like, You would be great at this, you should do it. And I'm sure he told 50 other people that he knows the same thing, but it made me feel really good because it when you're around Kevin, he just has a very unique way of making you feel like you're important when you're talking to him. And then another vendor would be Morty Smith. So, you know, back in his imagery days, we used them for some some things when I first got to marketing, and I remember just asking him so many questions, one after another, after another, after another. And then at our annual meeting that year, he just made time to sit down with me and he explains, you know, everything direct mail. I mean, he went through everything easy, DM, marriage mail, postage, examples, and you know, showed me examples of carrier routes and things like that. And it was just really awesome having someone invest their time into me to help me learn. I can never thank them for that. And then there's been so many others too, but and then of course, Mike, he's definitely been a mentor for me. I mean, I definitely wouldn't be in the position I'm in if he didn't believe me or believe in me.

Pete Shau 37:40

Um we're talking about Mike Tissett.

Jess Mahon 37:42

Mike Tissett, yeah. The Mike Tissett, the one and only.

Pete Shau 37:45

The one and only.

Jess Mahon 37:46

It's just an incredible feeling to know that you know he has your back even when you don't feel like you're worth it or you you're good enough to you know do what you're doing. And then, of course, my partner in the marketing department, Kate. I mean, we like I said earlier, we just bounce ideas off of each other, and she's talented at what she does. So yeah, I'll stop there. I know that was more than three.

Pete Shau 38:09

No, no, I mean, it's nice to put those people out there and let them know how you feel. I mean, first off, Kevin Silvers from uh King of Promotions and Robbie Tyson, he do a great job. I see Kevin everywhere, whether it be literal or whether it be through pictures, and he does get around, and he is a big, big part of what happens in the rent-to-owned space, that's for sure. Mike Tittsted absolutely huge in the idea that he's not only the president of Trib, but he also gets around to a lot of the events, and he is a he's a force to be reckoned with, right? He walks in the room and you just kind of know he's there because he's there. And that's something that not a lot of people have, but he does it and he does it very well. Being very connected to the RTO space in the industry really helps promote what we have going on, and he's really good at it, and it really helps to have him on your team. So that's you know, that's of course it's always amazing. And then when you have somebody at home who understands, you didn't say his whole name, and I don't know if you want to put his name out there, but you know, your fiance being a part of this and actually working in the industry, does he work for Rentone as well?

Jess Mahon 39:06

He does. So we actually met. Um, it's it's a funny story, I won't get into like the the whole thing, but um he I was hired to work at his store. Um, so I worked under him when I got hired. I was his account manager, and we just yeah, we just bumped heads though. I'm telling you, we um and it was because I think that he's grown a lot throughout the years, but he just was trying, he was kind of a newer, fresher manager at the time, and he had stuff to prove to himself and you know to his bosses, and here I am, this just new person. And I'm like, okay, I can't, I can't work under you. Like I and that's kind of why I volunteered to help at another store, not knowing that I would be moved permanently or given the opportunity to manage another store. Um, but then after I had gone to another store, I was like, oh gosh, I I don't I'd only been with the company for five months. I hadn't really networked with a lot of other managers. So I'm like, his name's Richie, Richie Baker, he's the store manager of the Zaynville store. I would be like, Hey Richie, um, how do I do this? So I learned very quickly, like it was a very humbling experience. Like, here I come into this, you know, job and I'm like, eh, and then so that's kind of how it all happened. But yeah, he's very supportive in having somebody understand like the ins and outs of the business is good. But we do keep it very separate too. I mean, you you have to. I mean, we give each other like 10 minutes to vent if it's a bad day and kind of move on with our day, but it's good.

Pete Shau 40:38

Put it away and then move on.

Jess Mahon 40:39

Yeah, we have to.

Pete Shau 40:41

So, how would you say, with with everything that's happening and all the people that you know and all the people that have helped you getting here? You said it earlier that the space of social media has changed. Uh from the Facebook that you did, you know, let's say 10, 12 years ago to what we're doing now. How would you say that social media really has changed a face of rent to own and how we do things as far as an online space?

Jess Mahon 41:04

Well, I think that the the biggest thing is that you're where the customers are. You're like, talk about being in their back pocket. I mean, you're literally in their back pocket on their cell phone. And it's just it's has sped everything up, honestly. The customer has a voice. I mean, they they have no problem letting you know what they like and what they don't like, right? I mean, I don't know if you you guys have a complaint singer or something like that, but I mean they they'll comment, they'll let you know, they'll, you know, write a review and tag tag you in it on their page. Um, so you you have an opportunity to fix issues or address issues quicker than maybe you would have in the past. And then also it's just everything's happening in real time. There's a lot less expense to it, I think. I mean, Facebook is becoming a a pay-to-play area, but it's not, even though it is kind of, it's still like so much less expensive than you know, mailing out 85,000 mailers. Um, you can take 10 minutes or less. I mean, you you you do some great videos. I've seen some things that you do to the the hardest part of that is coming up with a concept of like what you're going to do. But let's just say you're doing it basic, you're posting or you're going live 10 minutes, you know, like I want to sell this product, here's my caption, or I I have this message, let's go live, let's do it. And you say you want to boost it, spend $50 and boosting it, and you can still reach thousands of people with $50 telling the same story as if you know, would take the time to design a mailer and then and figure out then who you want to send it to, the list, and then send it to the printer, and then get it mailed, and then waiting for the customer to receive it, it's just created this fast-paced environment for us to reach our customers.

Pete Shau 42:52

With all the changes that are happening, because that's I mean, that that is so true. I mean, things happen at a different pace now than they did. It costs a little bit different to interact with your and your your customer base or your potential customer base. So when we're talking about the Facebook and the social media, do you guys do anything in Instagram, by the way?

Jess Mahon 43:10

We do. We do have an Instagram. Most of our Instagram content is just, I don't want to say copy and paste, but pretty much just from the meta platform, basically the same thing that we have on Facebook, with the exception of some reels. And we just did a live for the first time on Instagram a few weeks ago. We don't have as big of a following on Instagram as we do on Facebook, and it's harder to reach our customers on Instagram than Facebook right now. I mean, I definitely see that it that is the space that you know we we're growing and we need to grow, we need to get better at. But right now, it's just everybody, all like our customers are on Facebook, which I think is great because they're still we're still on social media, but it still gives us time to grow that audience on Instagram and still have a presence somewhere else. So that's kind of like what we're working on now.

Pete Shau 44:03

As we're talking about going to Facebook and then Instagram, I hear a lot of noise in the uh Snapchat and the TikTok area. I mean, is that where it's gonna go in five years? Do you see a lot of transition from Facebook and Instagram to that direction, in just in your opinion, or do you think a lot of it's still gonna be centered in the Facebook arena? Because I know a lot of our newer generations are staying away from Facebook. They are a lot more in Instagram and they are literally migrating to the Snapchat TikTok thing where it's a small kind of video, a lot faster. There's a lot more content available to the fingertips very quickly. Do you see us going into that mindset, that that kind of social media area in that arena?

Jess Mahon 44:45

Yeah, I think, I think, I don't know if it'll be the next five years, but the definitely the next 10 years, um, as our order customer, uh, this kind of just ages out, right? Like we do have to reach that younger generation. And you're right, they're not, you know, someone in their 20s might have a Facebook, but they're not on there as much as they are Instagram or TikTok. Um, and it's it's really how do we reach that customer on social media and we have to be where they are. But with TikTok specifically and even Snapchat, um, I think that if it's not those specific social media outlets, it's going to be something else. It's one thing that we all have to our advantage with Facebook and Instagram is the meta, you know, powerhouse, and they stay competitive. So if some other company or social media platform is doing something better and everybody's migrating to that, then you see Facebook changing what they're doing to bring you back and bring the younger audience in. Like, I don't know if you've heard of threads. Have you heard of that yet?

Pete Shau 45:45

I have not.

Jess Mahon 45:46

Okay. Yeah. So threads is Meta's version of Twitter or X, formerly known as Twitter. It is now it is through Instagram, and you have a threads profile, and it is Basically, like the old Twitter platform, and people are loving it, more and more people are adding to it or getting added, getting it added to their social media world every day. I don't know if it's going to be a thing of the future, but that's an example of Facebook doing whatever it takes to be competitive to the other uh platform. So I think TikTok is great. I think that it gives people an outlet to be creative, which is really what everybody wants to do. And with brands getting on there, I think that we have to have a presence. But the thing that I would I say, this is just my opinion, is that once a space starts getting crowded with a bunch of advertisements and ads, that's when people leave. So the most challenging thing for us is TikTok is full of influencers. But how do you get an influencer to promote our industry? That's that's tough. Like because we don't sell our own, you know, products really. We're selling other brands, right? So we have to promote what we do and who we are. Um, which again kind of just all goes back to what you should be promoting online anyway, through SEO and other strategies, is you what's going to make you comet competitive is who you are as a company. Why, why would they want to go to you, not what you have to offer them?

Pete Shau 47:30

That sounds like a huge hill to overcome. I've always felt weird about having somebody else do that, right? Because inside the RTO space, when you have uh, let's say you guys, rent-town is doing their marketing, and and let's say CPL group is doing their marketing, buddy's doing their marketing, and Aaron's is doing their marketing, and Magic is doing their marketing, it's all rent-to-owned based through rent-to-owned companies who know what it takes to get that done. And I always felt like if you don't have somebody that is a spokesperson, in other words, somebody who comes in and just totally does the advertising for you as the person that as the face, right, and you give it to an influencer, I always feel like it's possible to go the opposite direction if it doesn't go in the right, the right way that you expect, because that person might not be into the R2 um mindset as some of uh you know some of us. And so I always feel like today it might be great, tomorrow it might not be. I mean, is that a challenge when you when you come across these new things as just figuring it all out and getting it all processed as how it's gonna be tomorrow versus today?

Jess Mahon 48:28

Yeah, I mean, I I don't think it's like a challenge in the beginning, but it definitely is something you constantly have to think about. And I think that um for me, I overthink a lot of things that probably shouldn't be thought about in the beginning. But for example, the TikTok thing, like I would love to just be able to make funny dance videos in our store, but at the end of the day, I'm thinking, is that getting us rentals? How am I selling that, you know, product? What what else do we need? What else are we missing? And going back to the influencer thing, like there can't be just somebody who doesn't know our industry representing us because then it will fail. Because then, you know, say we have, you know, we'll just say Taylor Swift. I know this is an extreme example, but if Taylor Swift was the influencer for rent to own, people would be like, She doesn't rent to own. Like, I don't see her in a house like mine or owning anything that I own. So our best influencers honestly are the people in the stores, the CSRs, it's the managers, it's the people who believe in what they're doing and what they're selling to the customer. Those are the people that your customers see all the time.

Pete Shau 49:34

I completely agree with that. I really do. That's why I haven't done it. Uh, that's why I, you know, when they were coming up with faces and who do we want to do it, that's why I kind of stepped up because I don't know if giving it to somebody else who doesn't really understand the space will really embody what we want to say to our customer base and and how we want to be uh influenced that way as far as our customers. And so I agree with that right now. I don't know, I'm not saying that's forever, but I do agree that right now the best place for the marketing, the best faces for that would be the people in the industry, maybe the customers that are have been with us for a long time and really understand it, or some of the faces that have been in the industry for a long time, or even the people that we have at the store who people see when they walk in or might click on and see on the online. And uh when they do that, I think it just gives a friendly face and it creates that relationship that sits a little bit better with the customers as of this point. And uh, I mean, going through all that, what's probably the most important lesson you've learned, you know, going through all this? You've had some successes, you've had a couple of little failures, you've had people that have kind of helped you along. I mean, what's the what's one of the biggest things you've learned about RTO marketing in your career?

Jess Mahon 50:38

Man, uh that it changes so fast, and you know, you never know when a global pandemic is just gonna, you know, hit you square in the face. No, I think the the first thing that really comes to mind is you have to keep learning. I mean, you have to read the books and ask the questions and be curious because you know, there's always someone else in the room that has more experience than you, or who tried something that you've done, or your idea, and they've had more success than you have. So you just can't let that get to you and you can't take that personal. You you really need to look at that as an opportunity for yourself to learn from that person um and share ideas and share experiences. And it's way more fulfilling, honestly, than to think that you know everything or you have more knowledge than the next person. Um, that's that's really the biggest thing that I've learned, and also just from traveling to the shows and going to the shows and meeting so many people and networking is that the industry is not, you know, shy of sharing ideas with each other. And I love that. I I love going to shows and talking with people and hearing what they've done and trying, you know, bringing that back and then trying, you know, something that they had said and tailoring it to our company. And I just love that. I I love that this industry is 100% on board with, hey, I did this, you should try it too. Mentality. And also, I think the other biggest lesson I've learned is you have to disconnect from work at some point. You have to be present for the other important things in your life, um, or you're going to get burnt out, you're going, it's not going to be fun anymore. So, like, take the trip, go to the you know, birthday parties, or for me, it's like take my grandma to breakfast or walk my dog, whatever it is that you need to do, you you must make the time to do it and shut off a little bit.

Pete Shau 52:32

Well, that's why I love April. I mean, they encourage education and the exchanging of ideas. I was actually just reading in their past magazine, the one that just passed with Jerry Marshall on the cover. There are these uh I don't want to say bylaws, I I can't remember exactly what it was, but there was a list of what April has in their setup. And when you read them, it actually is an encouragement of changing, exchanging ideas for people that are in the industry. And I think that's so big. I mean, I think it's huge right now. Talking about books, because you just mentioned books, what books do you read that you think would help prepare somebody, either in the marketing space or the rent-to-owned space, to just be better at what they do that you've read?

Jess Mahon 53:08

Well, the last book that I just read, and I've read it before, but it's a really good book, is The Four Agreements. Um, and it really just talks about, you know, four agreements that you make with yourself to create joy and and just just different things in your life. It kind of talks about like how you want to live your life each day and go about each day and create new experiences for yourself and and be happy and things like that. And I think that's just the book that comes to mind, but I think it's a really powerful message because you can really take the message in this book and tailor it to all aspects of your life, including what you do every day. And it it's just like these are agreements that you have to make within yourself. What do you want? Um, and that's another thing, too, is like I'm gonna talk about my ticket for a minute, but he asks us a lot of questions at his company, which one of the biggest questions that he used to ask, the most popular question was, where do you see yourself in in five years? And you know, I hated answering that question because I feel like my answer was always just generic, like I want to own my house or I want to go on vacation, I want to get a new car, things like that. But um, I don't know if he just caught on to, you know, everyone's generic answer and and changed the technique from that, um, or if he read something because he's a he's an avid reader. But um, now his questions have impact and really like make you think. Um, for example, he asked things like, what juiced you up last week? Like, what got you going? What are you most proud of? And then right after that, he'll say, you know, what drained you? What are you least proud of? Or like who encouraged you this week? Who did you encourage this week? So impactful questions like that that really make you feel like you accomplished something today, and then think about what you can do better tomorrow or next week. I I know that his dad's very proud of everything he's done in the company and the success he's had, but he's he really encourages all of us to read and listen to podcasts, and um, he's given all of us the opportunity to be a part of Ryan Hawk's leadership training, which is good. So I think, yeah.

Pete Shau 55:24

That's good. I definitely encourage you to listen to as many podcasts as possible. There is one that I would encourage you to listen to every single episode all the time.

Jess Mahon 55:33

Is it the RTO podcast?

Pete Shau 55:35

It's the RTO show podcast. So because you've got so much knowledge to share, what would you say going into all of this? What is something that you would say to a young Jess starting out, you know, many, many years ago? What's a piece of advice that you would give that young Jess to say, hey, I think this will really this is a key bit of information, this is a golden nugget that's going to help you understand and tailor this space a little bit better, tackle things and kind of figure it all out just a little bit better than what you know now.

Jess Mahon 56:07

Um, I would say just be yourself. I mean, that sounds basic, but in the beginning of my marketing journey with Red to Own, because I didn't come from a marketing background, and you know, I I was like, you know, we had Kate who has a degree in graphic design. We have Mike who does come from a marketing background, and then there's me, you know, with business psychology. I worked at a bank. I'm like, there's no way I can do this. Like, I'm gonna look like a fool. It really like held on to that for a while, and I did a lot of reading and things, and all those things are great. You want to learn as much as you can, but in the beginning, I did it more because I wanted to prove that I could do it, not from the fact that I did believe in myself, I did have confidence, but I let this like mind stuff happen, and um then it caused me to be take a little longer to get on Facebook. Like now I get on Facebook Live for the company and it's not a problem. But it's in the beginning, I was like, Well, I don't want to be the face of the company, like I'm just a a nobody, I don't really know what I'm doing, kind of thing, and now I'm like, I get on there and I'm myself, and customers interact with me, and they're like, we haven't seen you in a while, or you know, just and that from all over the company. So just be yourself. That would be the one thing that I would say, and just be yourself, be a team player no matter how hard it is, because at the end of the day, everyone is here for the same reason. We all love helping our customers, and we're all gonna get through it together.

Pete Shau 57:42

The words of wisdom from Jess Mahan, the marketing director from Rent to Own, making it happen to RTO or Countryside Rentals, however that you want to put it over there in Ohio, doing great, great jobs working for Mike Tissett. You guys are just killing it over there. We do appreciate it. Listen, thanks everybody for listening to the RTO show. If you want to direct any questions to Jessica, please hit me up at the RTO show at Pete at the RTO Show Podcast.com. Or you can hit us up online. You can go to the social media platforms of Facebook or Instagram, look up the RTO show. You can hit us up directly, and I will answer some questions. If we have enough, we'll bring Jess back on for a short period of time so she can answer those questions for you. If you like this show, like and subscribe anywhere that you get podcasts, Spotify, whether it's Google Podcasts, whether it's Apple Podcasts. We want you to know what's going on. You can always get new merch at www.therto showpodcast.com. And we are now on APRO's website. So if you haven't seen that, go on there. You can also listen to us at rtohq.org. That's rtohq.org. Jess, it's been great having you on. I am so glad that you had the time to tackle this and let us know what's going on at R2O and how it's been for the last couple of years, because it's been a rat race, hasn't it? It's been ups and downs and forwards and backwards, but you guys are tackling it amazingly, and we do appreciate all the wisdom and time that you can spend with us on the show today. We thank you so much and tell your fiance he's doing a great job by keeping you focused and working on rent alone.

Jess Mahon 59:06

Thank you so much for having me.

Pete Shau 59:07

Thanks, uh, we'll catch you next time. Hey guys, here's a word from our prime sponsor. As always, the RTO show is proud to be sponsored by the Association of Aggressive Rental Organizations. April is consistently participating, educating, and watching Provide Open Rental Industry, and has been doing so since 1980.org. And while you're there, don't forget to subscribe to the RTOHQ Magazine and Twitter. Also, if you're not a member of April, find out how to become fun online at rto.org. That's it for the show today. Thank you for listening. And remember, you can also catch the RTO Show podcast on April's website, rto.org. Don't miss it out. We'll catch you next time. Remember, so we'll see.